thoughts on this please

Question

If during a full council meeting a Councillor makes a amendment to a proposal to increase the precept and the Councillor making the amendment wants to freeze the precept due to cost of living and the reserves are almost 5 months worth. The RFO turns to the Councillor and says " what qualifications do said Councillor have to justify their ammendment of using the reserves" and belittling the Councillor in public public video evidence has been saved. Would u class the words of the RFO Resonably?

Also second question when a Councillor puts in an amendment is it now the norm for the clerk to ask the chairman if he accepts the ammendment to be voted on. Ive checked standing orders which state something like any member can amend or make and amendment on any proposal on the agenda. We have never previously had to seek permission of the chairman to vote on it.

Answer 1

Use your standing orders to tell the clerk that only one person may speak at a time and that they should not interrupt a Cllr when speaking.
Cllrs make proposals, amendments and pass votes. Clerks record them

Comments

Aware of that but do you feel its appropriate for a clerk to ask a Councillor what qualifications they have to ammend or make other suggestions other than what they have cone up with as the RFO

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Can I put it this way.  I was a clerk of 30+ years and would not have even dreamt of asking such a question even though on occasions I might have thought it.

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Thats what i expected. In your opion whats best course of action on this as this clerk continues to belittle one councillor as that councillor doesnt always agree with the recommendations that are put forward

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Can I put it this way (again!).  If I as a clerk of 30+ years targeted one councillor and belittled them in a meeting then I would expect a) the chairman to silence me, and/or limit my comments to giving advice, and b) be unsurprised if I was called to another meeting (I'll leave you to work out the detail) to address the matter.

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Thankyou for that John unfortunately the chair did nothing and when raised previously with him and staffing was completely ignored but members of public saw it this time so complaints will be going in

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No, I certainly don’t think it’s appropriate.
I’d propose a suitable response to that clerk would be - my qualification is that of an elected representative of the community which by far and away exceeds your qualification as an employee of the council. Please don’t interrupt me again, you are disturbing the business of the meeting and it may be necessary to ask you to leave if you carry on.

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Bullying like this by Clerks is unfortunately not uncommon but if the Chair just shrugs their shoulders all you can do is replace the Chair
It’s also becoming the case that the Clerk prepares their Budget and any Councillor trying to amend it or raise valid points is considered to be attacking the Clerks competence
As I’ve said many times let’s take this to its logical conclusion by abolishing the role of Councillor and electing a Clerk every four years

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Interesting then - s117 (1)
Question - Does the clerk have a disclosable pecuniary interest in the preparation of the budget for council determination since employee salaries are an inseparable (often significant) element of the budgetary calculation.
I would suggest yes, they do.
So preparation and presentation of the budget by the RFO should be normal business. Getting all prissy and (as described in the OP) interrupting a Cllr proposing an amendment, simply shouldn’t happen.
Since we know it does, and we know why, the only effective means of countering such behaviour is to demonstrate a greater knowledge of the rules than the person that appears to be hiding behind them.
Imagine the guppy face if the Cllr had countered with - have you declared an interest in the discussion into the budget which provides your salary?

Please - somebody - do it and video the reaction );0)

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Bad  Chair (or badly trained or not experienced) first and foremost. Secondly councils fault for electing such a person to the position. The clerk should only give information when requested by the Chair as all business and comments must be addressed to and through the Chair. As to the hypothetical declaration of interest in the clerks salary as it is decided by committee and mutual consent of the clerk and must be ratified by council I would submit that it is already "declared".

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I’m not sure I entirely agree but if I did, and we take it as implied that the interest is declared, is there a dispensation to speak on the subject?

These are just the thoughts evoked from the original question