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+1 vote
My local parish council has banned me from attending council meetings for six months including contacting any Councillor or the clerk in any way, I asked the clerk a question which she did not like and then provided her proof of what I asked, she is a locum clerk, if I do she has threatened me with legal action, is this correct?
by (480 points)

4 Answers

+1 vote

No it would be unlawful to deny a member of the public access to a public meeting. In specific very limiited I understand circumstances courts have restricted attendance (suspect scenario was along lines of on police bail and werent allowed to contact or be near X who was reasonably likely to be in attendance given place of work). I have seen someone tried to be "banned" at a council they turned up sat down and basically said call the police.. (police did show up and basically ripped into clerk & chair) 

by (9.9k points)
+2 votes

Public Bodies (Admission to meetings) Act 1960 section 1 (4) (c) states "while the meeting is open to the public, the body shall not have power to exclude members of the public from the meeting"

Clerk is bluffing, there is no legal action that any serious solicitor would take on.

by (6.8k points)
This is what I've received
Gosh ???? , how much time you consume on council business is extraordinary!

 

Thank you for pointing this out. However, Warnham resolved, which is correctly minuted that they weren’t going to post the agendas on the noticeboards and only on the website. So, to answer this – “As an aside, the Clerk is required to take instruction from the council and if you council require them to publish the agenda on a noticeboard / office window, then they have to do it.” The council instructed me to do this so I did it. It is listed on the agenda when posted.

 

If ??????? wished to do this, they could also do it and have it resolved/minuted to do it.

 

In answer to your other queries, Cllr ? already confirmed that she placed the agendas on noticeboards by the bus shelter. So, the council did actually post the agenda in a physical copy.

 

I am not sure what part of the minutes you find severe? The minutes are recorded as a true version of the meeting, if you don’t want what you say in the minutes then it would be wise to think about it before speaking.

 

It is with great sadness that I am sending the second part to this email. I am writing to inform you that there has been a ban imposed on you for a period of Six Months. This restricts you from making contact with the council in any form, including attending meetings, calls or emails.

 

Over the past two months, your correspondence and attendance at meetings has been deemed deliberately destructive with the sole aim of causing a disturbance to the function of council business.

 

I have attached the Vexatious Complaint Policy for your reference, which was approved and accepted at the last full council meeting on the 20th March.

 

Should you breach this policy in any form, the council will seek further legal action against you.

 

Yours Sincerely

 



 

Locum Clerk

 

 

 

On behalf of Parish clerk

Email: clerk@

Website: [www.

Contact Number:
The office will be open from 9am - 2pm Monday - Thursday

 


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This email is confidential and intended for the use of intended recipient only. If you have received this email in error, please inform us immediately and then delete it. Any disclosure, copying, distribution or other action taken in reliance on it is unauthorised and may be unlawful. Although this transmission and any attachments are believed to be free of any virus or other defect that might adversely affect any computer system into which it is received and opened, it is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that it is virus free and no responsibility is accepted by ??????? Parish Council or its associates for any loss or damage arising in any way from its use.

 
To: Parish Clerk
 

Hi
 

Your clerk is incorrect on this one (and that is coming from a Clerk)

Schedule 12 (10) of the Local Government Act 1972 clearly states that an agenda has to be "fixed in some conspicuous place in the parish" and this has been taken to be a noticeboard or the office window - somewhere that can physically display the agenda.

I think where you clerk is coming from is the Transparency Code for Smaller Authorities 2014 which requires councils to have a website and publish their information on there.  But this is in addition to the LGS 1972, not an alternative.

The LGA 1972 criteria has not been rescinded or replaced by the Transparency Code.

As an aside, the Clerk is required to take instruction from the council and if you council require them to publish the agenda on a noticeboard / office window, then they have to do it.

 

 

 

I have read the draft minutes relating to the planning meeting and find them somewhat severe.



< – Vexatious Complaint Policy 2024.pdf>


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With respect Schedule 12(10) does NOT state that an agenda has to be fixed in some conspicuous place in the parish.  It says that a notice stating the time and place of the intended meeting has to be fixed in some conspicuous place in the parish.  Those two things are entirely different.  That said, it makes perfect sense to display an agenda as widely as possible.
+1 vote
Just turn up and take your seat…
by (24.6k points)
0 votes
any chance of seeing the vexatious policy referred to? thanks
by (1.9k points)
This is an email I received from the clerk.

? has passed me your email, as I have blocked your email address for the next 6 months.

 

During the last 2 months, you have shown yourself to be destructive towards council and the business that council is conducting. This is shown within the minutes which are attached. I have taken the liberty to attached them for Mr Baxendale’s reference. Recordings of the meetings can also be supplied to verify the minutes. During these months and after your resignation, you have continuously sent in emails, which have taken a large amount of time to address. Given the fact that the council has a locum clerk in post for 15 hours a week and that the council is paying for locuming services instead of an employed clerk, it is considered to not be cost effective to keep dealing with abusive, intimidating emails which serve no purpose. I consider your presence within the meetings threatening and intimidating.

 

The decision was not taken lightly.

 

The purpose of the Vexatious Policy is to allow the council the right to not reply to any correspondence sent in by whomever has been issued the policy, without reprimand.

 

Having never, in my years of clerking, having found the need to issue the policy, I assumed that it would extend to meetings. If the council has found someone to be destructive, threatening and or intimidating, having them present at the meeting would be counterproductive.

 

You are, as you state, free to attend the meetings, but as a council, your comments and or questions will not be answered. If anyone were to continue with destructive,  threatening and intimidation during the meeting, one of two things may happen, they may be asked to stop and leave, or be removed and or the meeting will conclude, and council will reconvene at another point in time.

 

Having spoken with Mulberry & Co and WSALC yesterday, they confirm that they have not heard from anyone from this council for months. To site their name and that contact was made, has caused concern with them. They have also confirmed that the policy is legal and has been adopted in the correct manner. If you disregard this policy as being legally binding, despite the correct process being applied, then you must raise questions about all the other council policies which have been adopted in the correct manner too?

 

Please note that any more correspondence sent into the clerk or councillors, will not be answered. We have a right now, to refuse contact with yourself for the next 6 months.

 

Mr ?????– If there is anything further you require from myself, I would be more than happy to offer you the correct version of events backed up with recordings or emails.

 
Vexatious Complaint Policy
Reviewed and adopted by E-resolution on the 15th March and approved at Full Council on the 20th March 2024
1.
Introduction
This policy identifies situations where a complainant, either individually or as part of a group, or a group of complainants, might be considered to be habitual or vexatious. The following clauses form the Parish Council’s policy for ways of responding to these situations.
1.1 In this policy, the term habitual means ‘done repeatedly or as a habit’. The term vexatious is recognised in law and means ‘denoting an action or the bringer of an action that is bought without sufficient grounds for winning, purely to cause annoyance to the defendant’.
1.2 This policy intends to assist in identifying and managing persons who seek to be disruptive to the Council through pursuing an unreasonable course of conduct.
1.3 The term complaint in this policy includes requests made under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 and the Data Protection Act 2018 and reference to the Complaints Procedure is, where relevant, to be interpreted as meaning a request under those Acts.
1.4 Habitual or vexatious complaints can be a problem for Council staff and members. The difficulty in handling such complainants is that they are time consuming and wasteful of resources in terms of Officer and Member time. While this Council endeavours to respond with patience and sympathy to the needs of all complainants, there are times when there is nothing further which can reasonably be done to assist or to rectify a real or perceived problem.
1.5 Raising of legitimate queries or criticisms of a complaints procedure as it progresses, for example if agreed timescales are not met, should not in itself lead to someone being regarded as a vexatious or an unreasonably persistent complainant. Similarly, the fact that a complainant is unhappy with the outcome of a complaint and seeks to challenge it once or more than once should not necessarily cause him or her to be labelled vexatious or unreasonably persistent.
1.6 The aim of this policy is to contribute to the overall aim of dealing with all complainants in ways which are demonstrably consistent, fair and reasonable.
a)
Habitual of Vexatious Complainants For the purpose of this policy the following definitions of habitual or vexatious complainants will be used: The repeated and/or obsessive pursuit of: unreasonable complaints and/or unrealistic outcomes; and/or
b)
reasonable complaints in an unreasonable manner.
2.1 Prior to considering its implementation the Council will send a copy of this policy to the complainant to give them prior notification of its possible implementation.
2.2 Where complaints continue, and have been identified as habitual or vexatious in accordance with the criteria set out in Section 3, the Council will seek agreement to treat the complainant as a habitual or vexatious complainant for the appropriate course of action to be taken. Section 4 details the options available for dealing with habitual or vexatious complaints.
NPC – Vexatious Complaint Policy 2024 2
2.3 The Clerk on behalf of the Parish Council will notify complainants, in writing, of the reasons why their complaint letter has been treated as habitual or vexatious and the action that will be taken.
2.4 The status of the complainant will be kept under review. If a complainant subsequently demonstrates a more reasonable approach, then their status will be reviewed.
3. Definitions
3.1 Nuthurst Parish Council defines unreasonable persistent and vexatious complainants as those complainants who, because of the frequency or nature of their contacts with the Council, hinder the Council’s consideration of their or other people’s complaints. The description ‘unreasonably persistent’ and ‘vexatious’ may apply separately or jointly to a particular complainant.
3.2 Examples include the way in which, or frequency with which, complainants raise their complaints with staff or how complainants respond when informed of the Council’s decision about the compliant.
3.3 Features of an unreasonably persistent and/or vexatious complainant include the following (the list is not exhaustive, nor does one single feature on its own necessarily imply that the person will be considered as being in this category): An unreasonably persistent and/or vexatious complainant may:

Have insufficient or no grounds for their complaint and be making the complaint only to annoy (or for reasons that he or she does not admit or make obvious).

Refuse to specify the grounds of a complaint despite offers of assistance

Refuse to co-operate with the complaints investigation process while still wishing their complaint to be resolved.

Refuse to accept that issues are not within the remit of the complaints and procedure despite having been provided with information about the scope of the procedure.

Refuse to accept that issues are not within the power of the Council to investigate, change or influence.

Insist on the complaint being dealt with in ways which are incompatible with the complaints procedure or with good practice (e.g. insisting that there must not be any written record of the complaint).

Make what appear to be groundless complaints about the staff dealing with the complaints, and seek to have them dismissed or replaced

Make an unreasonable number of contacts with the Council, by any means in relation to a specific complaint or complaints.

Make persistent and unreasonable demands or expectations of staff and/or the complaints process after the unreasonableness has been explained to the complainant (an example of this could be a complainant who insists on immediate responses to questions, frequent and/or complex letters, faxes, telephone calls or e-mails).

Harass or verbally abuse or otherwise seek to intimidate staff dealing with their complaint, in relation to their complaint by use of foul or inappropriate language or by the use of offensive and racist language or publish their complaints in other forms of media.

Raise subsidiary or new issues whilst a complaint is being addressed that were not part of the complaint at the start of the complaint process.

Introduce trivial or irrelevant new information whilst the complaint is being investigated and expect this to be taken into account and commented on.
NPC – Vexatious Complaint Policy 2024 3

Change the substance or basis of the complaint without reasonable justification whilst the complaint is being addressed.

Deny statements he or she made at an earlier stage in the complaint process.

Are known to have electronically recorded meetings and conversations without the prior knowledge and consent of the other person(s) involved.

Adopts a ‘scattergun’ approach, for instance, pursuing a complaint or complaints not only with the Council, but at the same time with, for example, a Member of Parliament, other Councils, elected Councillors of this and other Councils, the Council’s Independent Auditor, the Standards Board, the Police, other public bodies or solicitors.

Refuse to accept the outcome of the complaint process after its conclusion, repeatedly arguing the point, complaining about the outcome, and/or denying that an adequate response has been given.

Make the same complaint repeatedly, perhaps with minor differences, after the complaints procedure has been concluded and insist that the minor differences make these ‘new’ complaints which should be put through the full complaints procedure.

Persistently approach the Council through different routes or other persons about the same issues.

Persist in seeking an outcome which Council has explained is unrealistic for legal or policy (or other valid) reasons.

Refuse to accept documented evidence as factual.

Complain about or challenge an issue based on an historic and/or an irreversible decision or incident.

Combine some or all of these features.
4. Imposing Restrictions
4.1 The Parish Council will ensure that the complaint is being, or has been, investigated properly according to the adopted complaints procedure.
4.2 In the first instance the Clerk will consult with the Chairman of the Council prior to issuing a warning to the complainant. The Clerk will contact the complainant in writing, or by e-mail, to explain why this behaviour is causing concern and ask them to change this behaviour and outline the actions that the Council may take if they do not comply.
4.3 If the disruptive behaviour continues, the Clerk will issue a reminder letter to the complainant advising them that the way in which they will be allowed to contact the Parish Council in future will be restricted. The Clerk will make this decision in consultation with the Chairman of the Council and inform the complainant in writing of what procedures have been put in place and for what period.
4.4 Any restriction that is imposed on the complainant’s contact with the Council will be appropriate and proportionate and the complainant will be advised of the period of time over which that the restriction will be in place. In most cases restrictions will apply for between three to six months, but in exceptional cases this may be extended. In such cases the restrictions would be reviewed on a quarterly basis, or at the next Full Council Meeting.
4.5 Restrictions will be tailored to deal with the individual circumstances of the complainant and may include:

Banning the complainant from making contact by telephone except through a third party e.g. a solicitor, a Councillor or a friend acting on their behalf.
NPC – Vexatious Complaint Policy 2024 4

Banning the complainant from sending emails to individuals and/or all Council Officers and insisting they only correspond by postal letter.

Requiring contact to take place with one named member of staff only.

Restricting telephone calls to specified days and/or times and/or duration requiring any personal contact to take place in the presence of an appropriate witness.

Letting the complainant know that the Parish Council will not respond to or acknowledge any further contact from them on the specific topic of that complaint (in this case, a designated member of staff will be identified who will read future correspondence).
4.6 When the decision has been taken to apply this policy to a complainant, the Clerk will contact the complainant in writing to explain:

Why the decision has been taken.

What action has been taken.

The duration of that action.
4.7 The Clerk will enclose a copy of this policy in the letter to the complainant.
4.8 Where a complainant continues to behave in a way that is unacceptable, the Clerk, in consultation with the Chairman of the Council may decide to refuse all contact with the complainant and stop any investigation into his or her complaint.
4.9 Where the behaviour is so extreme or it threatens the immediate safety and welfare of staff, other options will be considered, e.g. the reporting of the matter to the police or taking legal action. In such cases, the complainant may not be given prior warning of that action.
5. New complaints from complainants who are treated as abusive, vexatious or persistent
5.1 New complaints from people who have come under this policy will be treated on their merits, The Clerk and the Chairman of the Parish Council will decide whether any restrictions that have been applied before are still appropriate and necessary in relation to the new complaint. A blanket policy is not supported, nor ignoring genuine service requests or complaints where they are founded.
5.2 The fact that a complainant is judged to be unreasonably persistent or vexatious, and any restrictions imposed on Council’s contact with him or her, will be recorded and notified to those who need to know within the Council.
6. Review
6. Review
6.1 The status of a complainant judged to be unreasonably persistent or vexatious will be reviewed by the Clerk and the Chairman of the Parish Council after three months and at the end of every subsequent three months within the period during which the policy is to apply, or by the next Full Council Meeting.
6.2 The complainant will be informed of the result of this review if the decision to apply this policy has been changed or extended.
7. Record Keeping
7.1 The Clerk will retain adequate records of the details of the case and the action that has been taken. Records will be kept of:

The name and address of each member of the public who is treated as abusive, vexatious or persistent, or any other person who so aids the complainant.
NPC – Vexatious Complaint Policy 2024 5

When the restrictions came into force and ends

What the restrictions are

When the person and Council were advised.
7.2 Full Council will be provided with a regular report giving information about members of the public who have been treated as vexatious/persistent as per this policy.
Adopted on:……………………….
At:…………………………………..
Review date:……
I would get expert advice (I am not one), but my opinion is they cannot stop you attending a meeting, as long as you are not disruptive, whatever their policy says. There are some clauses in the policy that might be challengeable, and I couldn't find one that said you could not attend a public meeting.(Aside:  I would check the practice of e-resolution mentioned - is this making the decision outside of a meeting and then just ratifying in the public meeting? if so, that might be challengeable on the grounds of councillors predetermining themselves.) I see the policy includes the clerk recording the names and addresses of anyone that 'aids the complainant'... presumably that would include your legal advisor, should you involve one. Policies like these are becoming quite common, and their application in practice, even if not in the policy itself, might well be legally challengeable. It would need someone to take it to judicial review I think, or make a claim against the council in some way. Then it would depend on the specifics of the case. I would seek expert advice. I don't mean your local ALC... as another poster has said, you might go along to the meeting and sit there and see what the police say... and video it... i can't see that they would throw you out. good luck
You might as well name and shame the council now. I can only find one council with this exact policy:-)
Nuthurst Parish Council, in my opinion it’s gone from being an excellent parish council to an appalling one, too many are on it for their own agenda which is a great shame, all this since May last year, a good clerk is great but since then they haven’t had a good one, the previous clerk who was fantastic resigned because she was getting too much hassle from a few parishioners, abusive phone calls and someone turning up at her house, we were really blessed with her but a few spoiled it

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